My Mechanical part of the program turned metric on me!

Joe Dunfee

The mechanical part of my BricsCAD 14 Platinum has turned metric on me. Any dimensions I enter for a component length are apparently taken as a metric value in mm.  Note that in the main program, if I draw a line, the values are accepted as architectural, which is how I have my units set in BricsCAD.  But, for example, if I use the mechanical browser to insert a 2"x2" square tube, that is 24" long, it comes in at 24mm long, though the 2"x2" profile is 2"x2".

This all happened right after I had obtained from a vendor in 3D DWG format that was in metric units.  I first opened that component DWG file, to examine it, and then inserted that DWG file into my main drawing.  The units problem persists after a deleting that component, and rebooting.

As I said earlier, the units in BricsCAD are set as architectural. I cannot find anywhere to set units for the mechanical part of the program.

Is there anywhere I can reset the mechanical units back to English?

-Joe

Scott McKenzie

Does the measurement variable have an influence here?

Joe Dunfee

Thanks for the idea, but my measurement units were already set to Architectural.

I did finally solve the problem.  I changed the drawing units to mm, then saved and exited BricsCAD.  Then, I opened BricsCAD and changed back to English units. 

Apparently the mechanical part of the program will copy the unit system when it senses they change, and then save it internally.   Perhaps my process forced a reset.

-Joe

Joe Dunfee

 Same thing just happened again on a fairly new drawing.  Again, I had created a part from vendor download.

But, when ever I get a vendor's part file, I always go through several steps that should isolate any settings they may have in their drawings.

The first issue with a vendor drawing, is that they are normally WAY too complex.  E.g. the threads of screws are modeled, and tiny fillets on edges are modeled.  And in this case the entire model was a highly surface, rather than solids.  So, there were no centers of the mounting holes, etc.  So, I basically create my own solids over their original model, and then copy my solids into a fresh drawing.  This should isolate it from any settings.  In this case, the vendor's drawing was already English units.  So, how metric crept in there, I don't know.

I have also noticed in the last several months, that a great many vendors are now only giving the metric units, and omit the English units entirely.  This may be because I have been shopping for linear actuators, which are mostly manufactured outside the U.S.  I finally found a vendor that gave English units, but I suspect, from seeing some of the odd dimensions, that the items are actually manufactured to Metric units.

Are the software vendors, and manufacturers colluding to try to force the U.S. to actually use the metric system?

-Joe

Joe Dunfee

 My trick of swapping between metric and English is not working this time.  So, that is not a universal solution.  I will e-mail BricsCAD tech support.

-Joe

Joe Dunfee

for some reason any time I load the BricsCAD forum reply screen, all text turns white.  So, I am typing this in a word processor, coloring the text as a dark grey, and then pasting into the reply screen, in hopes it shows up.

Since I am doing a lot with structural shapes right now, I really need the Mechanical library [ML], and this bug is getting to be quite a pain to deal with.

I have not heard any reply or acknowledgement from BricsCAD support.  I imagine they are very busy with V15. So, I am again asking the community if they have any ideas that may help.

In a hunt for clues about the trigger, I would like to ask if anyone else here ever even had this problem?  Do you have any clue what the specific trigger might be for this bug?

In my case, the only way to consistently stop it, is to exit BricsCAD and then start a new drawing, where I can insert the item I need from the ML.  If I open the drawing I have for my current project, and then open the Mechanical browser, as soon as I try to insert something from the mechanical library turns metric in its length units. Likewise, if I go back to the new drawing, and go to insert an object from the library, it turns back to English units.

So, something in my current project drawing is telling the ML to be metric.

Note that nothing inside my current project is actually an item from the ML.  To me the structural shapes are useless as mechanical objects, because there is no way to know what they are.  E.g. if I insert a 8x18.7 MC-Channel, and list the resulting block, it says *U146.  So, my normal practice is to just explode them into solids.

Any ML objects are exploded and purged, so there are no object in my drawing that should be informing the ML to use metric. The word “mechanical” is not in the settings dialog box, so there is no setting for the ML there, and as I mentioned before, the drawing units are set to Architectural.

I tried just typing “BM” at the command prompt, to see what BricsCAD Mechanical commands come up, but nothing looked like it would control units.

Is there perhaps a list of settings for the Mechanical part of the program, that is not part of the normal help file?

Thanks for any ideas, even if they are guesses.

-Joe

Jason Bourhill

Yes Bricsys have done a refresh of the website. It looks like this has broken the forum. I assume they have changed the CCS settings. This has happened before.

Regards, Jason Bourhill CAD Concepts 

Ignace

Hi,

@Joe I've tried to fix your post as well as I could, I hope no information is lost.

Like Jason said, there was quite an overhaul of the website, if you experience any problems with displaying a page, please use ctrl+F5 (cmd+R on Mac) to clear the cache.
If the page still doesn't show up properly, please file a support request (preferably with a screenshot), so we can take a look at the problem.

Joe Dunfee

 Thanks for attending to the problems on the web page.  Everything seems to work now.

And even though this forum was not able to help me directly with this metric problem, i think that simply having a place to go and post my issue is a help. It forces me to think logically through the problem so that I can  describe it to others.  As a result, it also helps me find a solution.

I think I have it solved.  I copied all the model space object, and then closed the drawing.  Then, I started a new drawing, and pasted the objects.  I followed that process in an effort to keep the new drawing as isolated as possible, and avoid any lingering data that Mechanical may keep in memory.

At some point in the past, I know I tried something similar, that didn't work.  Bu I don't recall the exact steps I followed. Anmyway, by posting what I just did here, I have created a log that I can go as a record of my past efforts.

Hopefully this current solution sticks.

-Joe

David Waight

@Joe Dunfee:

 Are the software vendors, and manufacturers colluding to try to force the U.S. to actually use the metric system?

-Joe

Metric seems to be good enough for NASA; so go on drag yourself kicking and screaming into the 20th Century!

It won't hurt honest!

David

Joe Dunfee

 In the U.S. metric is, in actual practice, a foreign language.  When I took a physics class a few years ago, I was frustrated that it was nearly 100% metric.  But, I decided to check if it was just this old guy, and took a survey of my fellow college-age students.  I asked them something like, if a 20kg object was most likely to be a paper clip, a baby, or an elephant? The only ones who knew the answer with confidence were foreign born, and only a few U.S. born had a guess.

When the metric system was created, it obviously had some component of political protest against England   Otherwise, they would have made the arbitrary units at least evenly convertible to English ones. E.g. the meter should have been set equal to the yard.  That would have made it more likely to be adopted, and accurate conversions possible.  And while the inertia of an existing system is a major part of the decision by industry against metric, I suspect the same political issues that were in the founding of the metric system are also behind the U.S. not adopting it.  

I recall being in school in 6th grade in 1976, when the U.S. officially made its conversion to metric.  But, it was quite throughly ignored by its citizens. All the industries I have worked in, have been exclusively English units, even including a medical device firm.

Finally, with schools now educating engineers with almost exclusive attention to metric units, I don't know what the future will be. The students in that physics class were certainly being forced to work in units that were gobbledygook to them, and therefore they were less likely to have really learned the concepts. And I suspect that graduates that can't work well in English units will be viewed as less capable, when they have to get trained in their new jobs.   Perhaps the push for metric in the schools has been behind the decline in engineering in the U.S.

-Joe

Richard Webb

Obligatory xkcd reference which actually is quite helpful. And then there's weight in "stone." We live in a crazy world...

Ranko Tomić

Well, SI system of units has it's inner logic, and most of different units are connected somehow in simple ratios (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metre_Convention#/media/File:Relations_between_New_SI_units_definitions.svg).

For example, meter and kilogram are connected through water density (one cubic decimeter of water weights one kilogram). Also, they are scaled up and down using decimal system (not eights or twelves etc). This can't be said for imperial units (which are also different in USA and UK, for example), and that is the reason why are those systems so different.

Joe Dunfee

I wanted to update you all.  Bricssys came up with the solution.  Although the insertion units are ignored, when the LUNITS are set to #2 (Decimal), the Mechanical Browser turns metric.  Changing it to #4 (Architectural) changes the Mechanical Browser to English units.  

I often work in decimal inches, but as long as I know the trigger for this behavior, I can deal with it.

-Joe

Scott McKenzie

Now that I have re-read your post and the solution I recall that setting the LUNITS variable to 2 would yield metric results; I too like to work with decimal feet and inches and have found that setting LUNITS to 3 is a good solution, it lets you operate with imperial units while using decimals.

It is my thinking that the output of the mechanical browser should be set based on the MEASUREMENT variable; as this is the variable that determines weather items such as line types and hatches use the imperial or metric definition files in the current drawing - in effect setting a scale factor.  The LUNITS variable shouldn't be the controlling factor for the scale in the Mechanical tools as this variable only controls the representation of a length value, when you switch between the different LUNITS there is no scale factor applied to your lengths and measurements, just how they are displayed to you.