Radius dimension annoyance
I never had any problems applying radius dimensions to arcs and semi-circles in Autocad. When we adopted BricsCAD V13, I discovered the command created an unnecessary, unsightly extension line. I created an SR, and rather than fix the problem Bricsys gave me a workaround. I could turn off "Ext line 1" in the properties menu. (See attachment "1.jpg")
We're now running V17, and have been taking this additional step for years. Today I applied a external radius to my 2D drawing, and I was not surprised to see the command overlay the extension line on top of the red arc. I replicated the radius on the upper part of the arc, and turned off "Ext line 1". The yellow dimension is the result of turning off "Ext Line 1"! (See attachment "2.jpg") That is not a proper radius dimension! I've also tried fixing this with the DRAWORDER command. Doesn't work.
Why can't Bricsys get this right?
Comments
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Couldn't duplicate your results using 18.2.04. If I understand the steps you took: pull two radius dimensions on the end of the figure, each with Ext Line 1 set "on." Then go into Properties for the upper radius dimension and set Ext Line 1 to "off." In my test, the upper dimension stayed put.
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Richard,
How did you do this without my *.dwg? Did you superimpose your screenshot on my screenshot?
These problems with radius dimensions have tormented me for years. I thought it had something to do with my dimension styles. But it happens with the standard dimension style also. Perhaps there is something wrong with my old templates? I use them as a starting point for all my drawings.I have attached a copy of the drawing. See if you can apply a proper radius dimension.
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@Jim Canale:
Yours is a special case. The polyline that is the outline of the strip has a revered normal (0,0,-1 instead of 0,0,1). If you correct this new radius dimensions look just fine. See the attached dwg. Can you explain how the block containing this polyline came about?In V17 you can create 'child' dimension styles. It may be useful to do so for radius dimensions. In such a child style you can then suppress extension lines. This would avoid 'manual' overrides.
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@Jim Canale said:
Richard,How did you do this without my *.dwg? Did you superimpose your screenshot on my screenshot?
Did you check your firewall logs? (ONLY KIDDING! ;-) I brought in the bitmap, used _align to stick it to a .75" vertical line, and drew a similar rectangle over the bitmap.
These problems with radius dimensions have tormented me for years. I thought it had something to do with my dimension styles. But it happens with the standard dimension style also. Perhaps there is something wrong with my old templates? I use them as a starting point for all my drawings.
I have attached a copy of the drawing. See if you can apply a proper radius dimension.
I get the same results as you described above when using your drawing; the radius dimension with Ext Line 1 set "off" pokes through to the other side of the circle.
I understand Roy's answer (math degree back in the Dark Ages) but I'm clueless as to how he was able to access that property or how to flip the normal back to a proper orientation. The Force is strong in that one.
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Thanks Roy. "Revered normal"? I don't understand. I wish I understood what you did to fix the problem.
In this particular case, I drew a rectangle, extruded it, drilled the holes, and radiused the corners. I let "Drawing Views" create the 2D views. Exported them back to model space. Exploded them. Changed to layers and colors I like. Created NEW blocks. Then dimensioned.
Why do I export the drawing views straight back into model space? Sore subject with me. I have had no end of problems doing proper dimensioning on the layout view. I don't like the tools they offer for sections, detail views, etc. Ordinate dimensioning doesn't work consistently in layout views, and often leaves me with dimensions that are FLAT OUT WRONG. I have proven it! I have been burned time and again on important drawings. And I can't even count on the "auto update" feature working. Dimensioning on the layout tab with the tools they give us "cramps my style".
I did thousands of 2D drawings manually, before we got "Drawing Views". The problem pre-dates drawing views.
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Richard,
I'm still trying to figure out what is meant by "the normal". Going home. My head hurts. Talk to you to later. Thanks for your help.
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The name 'normal' is used for a vector that defines the direction of a surface or plane. This vector is perpendicular to the surface or plane. In the case of a polyline it represents the direction of the positive Z-axis of the object. In 2D drawings you would expect this direction to match the direction of the positive Z-axis of the WCS. For the 'problem' polyline in the example this is not the case, its normal points in the opposite direction. Because the outline of the strip is symmetrical this can be corrected by using the _3DRotate command.
Apparently the reversed normal is problematic for radius dimensions: start and end angles of the arc segment are swapped, and both angles are mirrored.
This issue, and the fact that generated views can contain entities with reversed normals, are problems that can and should be fixed IMO.0 -
Roy,
Thanks. I'm trying very hard to digest this.... I DID know a "normal" is perpendicular to a plane. I DID NOT know it is assigned a DIRECTION matching the Z axis of the WCS. How does one even know the DIRECTION of a plane or surface, relative to the WCS?
I used _3D_rotate command to rotate the view 180 degrees about the x axis, and it does indeed solve the problem.
Regarding getting this fixed.... Would you like to communicate this to the support group, or do you think it would be sufficient for me to simply reference this thread to them?
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@Jim Canale:
Referencing this thread should be enough I think.To check the direction of a normal you can use the _Ucs command and switch between the _World (WCS) and the _Entity option.
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