Components !?

Michael Mayer

I read the whole Bricsys Help Center,
at least for Components but I don't get it.
I may be totally wrong with my PITA but as far as I understand :

1.
a)
Why can't I replace a Component by an "internal Component" ?
b)
Why can't I edit an "internal Component" like a Block ?
c)
Does switching a Component from external to internal not have
a representation of the Component Definition in my File,
but just a Lock Setting to keep my inserted Components excluded
from later changes of the original Source ?

2.
When I want to edit an "external" Component
(to also change all my inserted Components)
why does it only offer to open a Copy and not the original Reference File ?
Do I need to search for the File itself manually in Finder ?

3.
Why can I assign a Building Material (including a Render Material) to a
Component, by I editingt the Component File Copy, but when I replace
my inserted Components by that Component Copy File I can't see
any Render Material ?

I set Material to "by Component" wherever I could and Updated Components,
Mechanical Palette shows that Building Material, but there won't be seen any
Render Material (nor will be imported into my local Materials in File ?)
until I manually apply a Material to each inserted Component by
Property Palette (?)

I'm pretty much confused.

Michael Mayer

4.
a)
I also don't get the logic of when and what arbitrary
Components the Mechanical Browser switches highlighting,
when I select any kind of Objects in my Drawing View.
(Mostly more than 1 top level Component when I selected
an inserted Component)
b)
When and why not, selecting Components in Mechanical Browser
will highlight inserted Components in my model.
And why the highlight disapears when I do any View Navigation

5.
a)
Are Components mandatory, or better the only Elements that
I can "inser"t into BIM Solids ?
b)
Or could I also insert standard Blocks - as soon as they have
a BIM_SUBTRACT Volume ?
c)
Why does Structure Panel not show any BIM_SUBTRACT Volumes,
when I edit a Component Copy File ?

Roy Klein Gebbinck

1C:
The component definition of a local component is stored in the drawing.

2:
At the top of the MB (mechanical Browser) context menu there is an 'Open' entry if the component is external.

4A:
There are indeed some issues there. Maybe send in an SR?

4B:
I think this is intended. Even moving the cursor over the drawing area removes the highlighting. To select components you can use the MB context menu.

5C:
On my system BIM_SUBTRACT solids are listed in the Structure Panel. I am still using V18 though.

Michael Mayer

Thanks Roy.

@Roy Klein Gebbinck said:
1C:
The component definition of a local component is stored in the drawing.

OK, but Access Denied ...

2:
At the top of the MB (mechanical Browser) context menu there is an 'Open' entry if the component is external.

OK.
That would help.
I thought inserted "Balloon" Library Components, or BIM INSERT File
would be external, ~~but I don't get the Open Option on Mac so far.
Only Open Copy. Have to retry on Windows.~~
(Also Replacing Components seems to have no effect)

EDIT :
It works I get the Open Dialog.
Inserted Balloon Objects or BIMINSERTS from File are not external.

4A:
There are indeed some issues there. Maybe send in an SR?

Yes, as soon as I feel that I have a minimal amount of overview
of Components and understanding what I do.

4B:
I think this is intended. Even moving the cursor over the drawing area removes the highlighting. To select components you can use the MB context menu.

OK (?)
I would propose a special dimmer Component highlight color, persisting
as long as the Component is Selected in Mechanical Browser, instead.

5C:
On my system BIM_SUBTRACT solids are listed in the Structure Panel. I am still using V18 though.

Have to recheck that.
I already tried standard Structure Modes and checked for any exclusion
but was not able to show them in my Solids Folder.

EDIT :
OK,
on Mac Subtract Solids appear in Stucture Tree

Michael Mayer

@Michael Mayer said:

3.
Why can I assign a Building Material (including a Render Material) to a
Component, by I editingt the Component File Copy, but when I replace
my inserted Components by that Component Copy File I can't see
any Render Material ?

I set Material to "by Component" wherever I could and Updated Components,
Mechanical Palette shows that Building Material, but there won't be seen any
Render Material (nor will be imported into my local Materials in File ?)
until I manually apply a Material to each inserted Component by
Property Palette (?)

I'm pretty much confused.

So for 3.
I think the problem is not on Component Level.
It works now for me updating external Components fine.

The Bug is pretty basic.
When you add a Building Material to your file that has a
Rendering Material, Bricscad forgets to also add the
Render Material to the File.

That is why I often experienced such Material Problems
in many different situations already.
The Workaround is to go through your Building Material,
look for the Render Materials they use and add those
manually to your local Render Materials.

EDIT :
SR'ed

Roy Klein Gebbinck

1A:
There are still some important features missing from BricsCAD components. This would be one of them.

To replace A with B (local) you can try this experiment:

1. Make B external to get a B.dwg file.
2. Turn B back to local.
3. Replace A with B.dwg.
4. Turn Component from step #3 to local.
5. This seems to work but actually you now have two separate, but identical, component definitions in your file. That these have the same name is undesirable IMO.

1B:
Another missing feature that I would consider important. Maybe _BEdit can be extended to also handle components?

5A+B:
It may be a bad idea if blocks can be used instead of components here.

Michael Mayer

Thank you Roy.
You help a lot for understanding Components.

@Roy Klein Gebbinck said:
1A:
There are still some important features missing from BricsCAD components. This would be one of them.

OK !
So that is not a strict intended definition for behavior but just a WIP.

To replace A with B (local) you can try this experiment:

So maybe a WIP though too.

1B:
Another missing feature that I would consider important. Maybe _BEdit can be extended to also handle components?

I also thought there might be areason that I don#t understand behind.

5A+B:
It may be a bad idea if blocks can be used instead of components here.

Also just a question without any judgment.
Until now I didn't notice Components before nor did I really look at
Insertion Elements.
(With Insertion Elements I always mean Objects that I "insert" into
another Solid. Not standard Library Objects)
I always thought that Insertion Objects like Windows are just external
separate DWG files that will be imported as Referenced Blocks.
I thought I would insert "Blocks".

• -

I still don't really understand the difference between Blocks and Components,
as I still don't really understand the "Named Groups" thing and how far
Components differ from these.

Components can include complicated parametric constraints and be inserted
into other Solids,
(Like a BIM Plugin Object in Vectorworks, which is created and edited by a "Tool"
while in Bricscad the Object itself is the "Tool ?)
while they could also be the dumbest simple Line, to just throw into your File
from the "Components" Library.

I wouldn't have expected the existence or creation of a new Container Object
in Bricscad, when I recently learned that Autocad Blocks have a endless set of
non standard behaviors, features and types so that they can do all and
everything,
So is the reason for Components existence maybe just the workaround to
avoid patent infringements of Dynamic Blocks ?

But will Components also help me to get away with Autocad Blocks ?