shadows in generated elevations

fkl

Is it possible to show shadows in 2D elevations which are generated from the model.

fkl

Or how can I create elevations with shadows?

Michael Mayer

I think you would need to render the 3D Model from a side view.
And if needed stack one or more viewports with different render
modes like hidden line on top.

But I do not really get real control over rendering and lighting in
Bricscad. Whatever sun settings I use, the light seems to always
come from left behind.

Tom Foster

That's right - should we complain?

Michael Mayer

Tom Foster said:

That's right - should we complain?

I am not sure ....

Bricscad licensed RedSDK since many years, which offers nearly all we could wish for high end
Visualization (CPU Renderer, GPU Renderer, physical based Materials, Global Illumination, ....)
But Bricscad until now instead stayed with basic Raytracing and standard Materials.
(About a state that Microstation offered in the mid 90ies)
So I did not see any ambitions or development in that direction from Bricscad at all, unfortunately.

Instead they went a workaround by integrating Enscape Real Time rendering engine in a proprietary
way as a subscription paid plugin for Bricscad and unfortunately just the render engine only,
without Enscape's any other Features like Material controls, Assets, Sky System, ....
This is bad because when owning an Enscape license (also subscription only!), you can use it
with any other compatible Software you own in parallel.
Like if you already use Enscape with e.g. Vectorworks, Sketchup, Rhino and Archicad,
you would need another Enscape PlugIn Subscription for your Bricscad.

At least Bricscad offers also support for Twinmotion/Unreal Engine by Datasmith Export.
Unfortunately there is still no Datasmith Export on Bricscad for Mac !?
(Strange, Vectorworks on Mac offers Datasmith since years)


And in general,
Bricscad is now no more family enterprise as it was in the past but bought by another
company since some years now. And I am still not sure what the long time strategy for
Bricscad will be or what changes to expect.
(heading to Subscription only, price increases, slowed down development, cutting
Apple ARM support or even cross platform availability at all .... ?)

I now just see small differences in communication here on the forum.
On one hand even more developers chiming in directly for helping users with their tools,
on the other hand less open about directions in development.

I think we may see a bit more by the next round in November where they are heading to
or if some of us have to left the boat.

So if we should complain, if we maybe just don't fit the target audience - I don't know.

Tom Foster

Hmm - much info and perspective there - thanks.
But "maybe just don't fit the target audience" - we're just talking of making solar/shadows work as intended!

Michael Mayer

Yes, I think Solar Animation (or even basic shadows in Viewports)
is a pretty useful feature for an architectural CAD App.

(Very comfortable in my other primary CAD)

But the only way I can think of for Bricscad as it is,
is by a Viewport in a shaded render mode and putting a HL viewport
on top if line work needed.
There may be some useful options by a custom Visual Style Setup
that may work with a single Viewport.

But would love to also read some better ideas.

fkl

Strange,
that a bim solution with so much advanced features, like bimify and propagate, doesnt have basic functionality for creating simple shaded elevations for documentation purposes. A standard function in every other architecture software.
I think we should complain.

D. R. C.

From a SR I sent in 2020:

Q: Is it possible to include solar shadows in sections/elevations?
A: Unfortunately this is not possible in BricsCAD. Currently, our team has no plans to add shadows in elevations and sections.

Tom Foster

Whaaat?!

fkl

That's not promising.
I hope they will change there mind.

Knut Hohenberg

Vector shadows (transparent hatches) would IMO be an important feature for any CAD program (not just for BIM), since you cannot get this functionality by exporting to another tool (as opposed to rendering, for which there are numerous options).
Unfortunately, it would probably require a substantial amount of development resources, since it AFAIK cannot be achieved by integrating third party libraries, and would have to be written from scratch. So the answer to the SR does not come as a surprise to me.
But it should at least be possible to superimpose a line drawing (e.g. generated view) over a rendered viewport with shadows.
This worked in V15, where viewport shadows were raytraced, and thus clear and crisp. Sadly, in V16, viewport shadow generation was changed to use shadow buffers, which gives more or less blurry results that are mostly unacceptable for architectural purposes. I complained back in 2015 (SR 66314), and Hans de Backer (then head of development) promised a fix, but the issue fell into oblivion, and my last attempt to reopen the subject went unanswered.
So maybe joint complaining might trigger some rethinking on Bricsys' side...

Simon_NL

Does v23 offer a solution for creating shadows in 2D (BIM generated) elevations?

RubenDBricsys

In V23, we added a background images to the sections as an experimental feature.

See the BricsCAD Summit session below, or the helppage.

Let us know what you think!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2fjyYZcqpE&t=1057s

Michael Mayer

RubenDBricsys said:

Let us know what you think!

I think that the whole presentation and its new V23 features
are absolutely great.

Obviously I missed the Background image in Elevations
when I saw the video for the first time.
Just one thought.
For me, setting the Background Image Render Style by setting
the Model Space View Style, sounds very user error prone.
I think that Setting should be part of the Viewport Properties,
"Background Rendering"


And why do I miss all "Typed Plan" default offers or new "View Styles"
like Black&White - on Mac ?

ScottS

RubenDBricsys said:

In V23, we added a background images to the sections as an experimental feature.
See the BricsCAD Summit session below, or the helppage.
Let us know what you think!

Terrific!
But how to control the resolution? When I tried, it generated an 80 pixel x 43 pixel .png image—too blocky even for a thumbnail.

I hope as this new feature matures it will be accompanied by improved lighting and shadows.

Michael Mayer said:

And why do I miss all "Typed Plan" default offers or new "View Styles"
like Black&White - on Mac ?

I don't find those new Visual Styles on Windows, either.

Simon_NL

RubenDBricsys said:

In V23, we added a background images to the sections as an experimental feature.
See the BricsCAD Summit session below, or the helppage.
Let us know what you think!

Thanks.
What would be the best Visual style to generate shadows on the background image?

To try it out I used the visual style 'Shades of Grey'. Besides the shadows it also creates fairly wide background lines of the geometry which interferes with my 'normal' format.
The backgroundimage which apears also has a distinct boundary which apears on the plot.
How can I remove this boundaryline?

RubenDBricsys

Michael Mayer said:

For me, setting the Background Image Render Style by setting
the Model Space View Style, sounds very user error prone.
I think that Setting should be part of the Viewport Properties,
"Background Rendering"

Indeed, that's something we'll need to improve.

Michael Mayer said:

And why do I miss all "Typed Plan" default offers or new "View Styles"
like Black&White - on Mac ?

The Black&White visual style from the video didn't make it to the final release. But there are some other new visual styles that should be available in all OS's: Maquette, Render, See-through, ...
Can you find those?

ScottS said:

But how to control the resolution? When I tried, it generated an 80 pixel x 43 pixel .png image—too blocky even for a thumbnail.

You can't yet manually set the resolution, but the default value should be better than that. Could you send us the file (here or in a Support Request) to investigate?

Simon_NL said:

What would be the best Visual style to generate shadows on the background image?

To try it out I used the visual style 'Shades of Grey'. Besides the shadows it also creates fairly wide background lines of the geometry which interferes with my 'normal' format.
The backgroundimage which apears also has a distinct boundary which apears on the plot.
How can I remove this boundaryline?

Have you tried 'Maquette'?
There's no easy way to get rid of those boundary lines for now. But thanks for the feedback, we'll have a look at it.

Michael Mayer

RubenDBricsys said:

The Black&White visual style from the video didn't make it to the final release. But there are some other new visual styles that should be available in all OS's: Maquette, Render, See-through, ...
Can you find those?

I think I have seen and tried them already.

But that must have been either in Beta or only in Windows.
They are not available in my final V23 on Mac.

(Or they stored in the File ? As I often even do not have BIM visual style
with DWGs from other sources .....)

EDIT :
Yes, I see the Visual Styles - when creating a new File from BIM Template.

I think it is OK that custom visual styles, made from scratch, are safed in the file only,
but as we also get some basic Visual Styles when opening foreign DWGs,
I would welcome if we could still get the whole package of default Visual Styles.

Or make the whole repertoire system wide.
If there are reasons to limit Visual Styles, I would prefer depending on Bricscad's
"run as level" or according to workspace.
(If that makes any sense)

As I have Bricscad BIM and mainly want to do BIM,
no matter if my Files originate from BC BIM Templates or exported from clients.


But I will import the Visual Styles from Drawing Manager for now.