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Having mechanical and BIM in one package no longer possible???

RSWRSW
edited November 12 in Other

Right now I am having a not so amusing Autodesk verticals deja vu but I hope it's not going to be that bad and that BricsCAD is not completely going the AutoCAD route with market segmentation and related verticals.

When I read that the sheet metal module would be combined with platinum to become BricsCAD mechanical I was slightly worried this might be start of AutoCAD style verticals, but there was no mention of the BIM module going to disappear as well and was glad to see terrain modelling coming in BricsCAD BIM so I thought it would still be possible to have BIM and sheet metal/mechanical in one CAD package.

Much to my unpleasant surprise right now there now seem to be only three options:
- Platinum without BIM and without Sheet metal (Mechanical)
- Platinum with BIM - but no mechanical = BricsCAD BIM
- Platinum with sheet metal but no BIM = BricsCAD Mechanical (which is going to include the Communicator in spring next year according to some articles).

No mention of separate Sheet metal/Mechanical and BIM modules, and the communicator module may disappear as module as well in the near future.

How about those of us who now have both the BIM and Sheet metal (and Communicator if applicable, which I do have as well but not everyone may have it) modules because we work multidisciplinary and do general 2d/3d drafting, civil, BIM and mechanical etc.? Will it still be possible to have BIM and Mechanical the old way like it was with the modules of will we be forced to buy BricsCAD Mechanical AND BricsCAD BIM licenses to be able to work in multiple disciplines and as such making the total more expensive than a complete AutoCAD suite? Or will there be an option to have the BIM or Mechanical functionality added to BricsCAD Mechanical or BricsCAD BIM respectively?

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Comments

  • I am also confused. There is Mechanical Browser and Design Intent in v18 Platinum, what I understand is these are gone if upgrade to v19 Platinum without Mechanical module.

    So my understanding is some mechanical related features removed in Platinum but merged in Sheet Metal module.

    Also All-in-maintenance seems mandatory, I cannot remove it.

  • RSWRSW
    edited November 12

    Well... I am on active maintenance (renewed in September this year) for Platinum and all V18 modules (Sheet metal, BIM and Communicator). So far my account is only showing license keys for Platinum V19 and Communicator V19 and sheet metal, bim and some mechanical functionality is now missing compared to V18.

    When I look at the license dialog there are only entries for V19 Platinum (incl. basic and pro) and Communicator V19 and then upgrades to either V19 Mechanical or V19 BIM for several hundred euro plus additional maintenance so you are not the only one wondering about that.

    To get some answers from those who should know I filed a support request as I am wondering too if I now just lost my sheet metal (and some mechanical) and BIM functionality and asked if the license keys for sheet metal/mechanical and BIM functionality would be provided to my account a bit later or that I would need to upgrade to V19 Mechanical or V19 BIM and lose the other part and only get that back by purchasing a new full license for the lost functionality I assume I still should have.

    V19, based on glancing through the release notes, seems to be a quite good improvement over V18 as it addresses several of my major needs such as DGN to DWG import, PDF to DWG conversion, improved exports and some things in Mechanical such as improved BOM, part arrays etc. as well as quite a few general and welcome improvements in more general areas. Hopefully some of stability issues will be solved in V19 as well but that is something I will find out when I can work with it (assuming the modules issue does get solved).

    I just hope that BricsCAD BIM and BricsCAD mechanical are both contained in the installer and can be activated like the modules in V18 instead of becoming separate code bases requiring two licenses like Autodesk was doing with e.g. AutoCAD Map and AutoCAD Civil etc.

  • I as someone who added Maintenance recently only,
    I am a bit confused with everything related to Upgrades and Versions
    in general.
    And beside the Upgrade Options, seems that the Maintenance or Upgrade
    fee between PLATINUM+BIM and NEWBIM has nearly doubled ?

    I personally don't need mechanical but can understand very well that
    some may need both, BIM+MECHANICAL.

    The only thing I really like is that, instead of a tedious PLATINUM+BIM with
    all separate Licensing, Upgrade and Maintenance, redundant administration
    work, there is a complete single BIM Version now.

  • RSWRSW
    edited November 12

    Hurray :-)

    Just after writing the above response I received an e-mail from support with a new license code containing the functionality of Platinum with the "old" V18 sheet metal and BIM modules for V19.

    Which means that the functionality is all contained in the installer.

    @fredericklim (and everyone else in the same boat) You need to contact support and file an administrative request to have the functionality of the sheet metal/mechanical module added by a new license key. Of course you need to have an active all-in maintenance for Platinum and the respective modules.

    This is such a relief, as well as great and fast customer service. :smile:

  • @Michael Mayer said:
    I as someone who added Maintenance recently only,
    I am a bit confused with everything related to Upgrades and Versions
    in general.
    And beside the Upgrade Options, seems that the Maintenance or Upgrade
    fee between PLATINUM+BIM and NEWBIM has nearly doubled ?

    I personally don't need mechanical but can understand very well that
    some may need both, BIM+MECHANICAL.

    The only thing I really like is that, instead of a tedious PLATINUM+BIM with
    all separate Licensing, Upgrade and Maintenance, redundant administration
    work, there is a complete single BIM Version now.

    It looks like you can still combine BIM and Mechanical etc. but it is now all one single license key, so if you add a "module" (or drop one) then you need to have a new license key.

    The website and license manager are confusing at the moment as it now looks like you have Bricscad basic, pro or platinum and then Bricscad Mechanical OR Bricscad BIM and that you can't combine it. Especially for existing customers who previously had a module this gets even more confusing as you initially get a platinum license code and then only see an option to upgrade to Mechanical or BIM. I guess the license keys for Platinum + the former modules are trailing behind a little bit as they need to figure out who needs to be moved to V19 mechanical or bim (or both).

    Yes the price increase for new licenses is a bit more than I expected though the maintenance listed with the upgrade to BIM or Mechanical doesn't seem to be excessively more than previously for V18. When becoming part of a very large company this was to be expected.

    There is definitely a different perception of what constitutes an affordable price between small companies like Bricsys targeting mostly small and medium business clients with some large corporate ones and huge ones like Autodesk, Adobe (and Hexagon) who aim mostly at large corporate clients with deep pockets. Autodesk and Adobe both more or less (supposedly) said they are not really interested in small business clients (like most architects etc.) On the other hand, if the price difference with AutoCAD/Revit/Solidworks etc. becomes too small it will be harder to "seduce" people to switch to BricsCAD unless they can show BC is quite a bit better (which I think it is in some areas as I dropped Solidworks for Bricscad Platinum + Sheet Metal despite Solidworks having some really nice tools but I noticed Bricscad Mechanical seems to be getting some of them too now based on the release notes).

  • I need only BIM, not both.

    I also noticed some changes in my License Center after I send my SR.
    At first it looked like the Upgrade to NEWBIM would be about nearly
    the price I paid for my v18+BIM.
    Which looked like the BIM Plugin would have been forgotten and it is
    an upgrade from Plan v18 Platinum to NEWBIM.
    So far it is a different price now but still looks like my Maintenance
    from a few weeks got forgotten or will overlap with new Maintenance
    and such ... so I will wait for the SR answer.

  • Maintenance is valid for the new BIM and Mechanical versions if you already have a BIM or SheetMetal module with active maintenance so you should get a new license code for NEWBIM. Though there can be some glitches in the system as I recently got contacted by the local office that I am still on an older version (V15 or V16) even though I am on maintenance for a few eyars and was using V18 since the day it became available. If your license code comes from the local office in Germany then it could be that their records are not up to date yet. A SR, as you already sent out, should solve this.

  • edited November 12

    I should think HQ is being deluged with worried/baffled enquiries right now!

    As soon as I heard it, at conference, that BricsBIM and BricsMech would become Adesk-style verticals, I had the doubts being expressed here (themselves hard to decode) - but now I detect a suggestion that e.g. Mech may after all be available as add-on to BricsBIM (not having to buy BricsMech in full as well as BricsBIM).

    Correct me if wrong, but I see little advantage in doing it as verticals, rather than Platinum + Bim and/or Mech. The bit about only having one License code seems trivial.
    Unless the version of Platinum in each is in some way different,
    or with some hitherto Platinum platform-type features denied to Bim users, and some ditto denied to Mech users.
    For instance the Mech-version of Section planes no longer available to BIM users.
    Or some DM features only in one or the other, in expectation of 'typical' Mech vs BIM uses.

  • So far my v18 Platinum + BIM + (2* Maintenance)
    is converted to 1x v19 Platinum only.

    BIM + BIM Maintenance somehow fell under the table
    and v19 asks for another upgrade to BIM (?)

  • edited November 12

    Hi I wanted to ask something about blockify, because its not working for me, maybe I am using it wrong....
    but I searched 15 min to find the forum.....
    and now I'm reading all this questions....

    to be honest, the first time I heard about Hexagon it was a punch.....
    I also want to use both BIM and Mechanical.....
    I didn't tried my licenses so I can not say anything, but it makes me a little bit confused what license I still have BIM and Sheet Metal?

  • @fs_at12 said:

    I also want to use both BIM and Mechanical.....
    I didn't tried my licenses so I can not say anything, but it makes me a little bit confused what license I still have BIM and Sheet Metal?

    If you have all-in maintenance for BIM and SheetMetal under V18 and it is still active you may need to contact support to request a new license key if the license key you have now for V19 only shows platinum. Explain to them you have active maintenance on both modules and they should then send you a new license key that will activate both BIM and SheetMetal on V19.

    If you don't have a license yet, then contact sales and ask them what it costs to have both BIM and SheetMetal in one license.

    I have both BIM and SheetMetal activated on the same license and it is called BricsCAD Master Suite in my account instead of BricsCAD BIM or BricsCAD Mechanical. Communicator will become included as part of Mechanical in spring next year as mentioned somewhere in the conference reports or the blogs and then probably cease to exist as a separate module.

    I haven't got to trying blockify yet so can't help you with that at the moment.

  • @Tom Foster said:
    I should think HQ is being deluged with worried/baffled enquiries right now!

    As soon as I heard it, at conference, that BricsBIM and BricsMech would become Adesk-style verticals, I had the doubts being expressed here (themselves hard to decode) - but now I detect a suggestion that e.g. Mech may after all be available as add-on to BricsBIM (not having to buy BricsMech in full as well as BricsBIM).

    Correct me if wrong, but I see little advantage in doing it as verticals, rather than Platinum + Bim and/or Mech. The bit about only having one License code seems trivial.
    Unless the version of Platinum in each is in some way different,
    or with some hitherto Platinum platform-type features denied to Bim users, and some ditto denied to Mech users.
    For instance the Mech-version of Section planes no longer available to BIM users.
    Or some DM features only in one or the other, in expectation of 'typical' Mech vs BIM uses.

    Based on what I see in my account having both BIM and Mechanical is called BricsCAD Master Suite, so yes it looks like it is possible to have both available even though it is not (yet) advertised on the Bricsys website.

    My guess is that there is one code base for BIM and Mech (which is a good thing) but like e.g. smartphones and other consumer devices with lots of similar models the differences between what is active and not in BIM vs Mech is controlled by some software code (there are quite a few smartphones out there that have basically the same hardware but the available hardware features are controlled by the software that the manufacturer installs and "simpler" models are basically "hardware crippled by software" versions of somewhat higher specced models, the same can be done with software).

    I can understand providing "verticals" instead of Platinum+BIM module of Platinum+Mech module as an off the shelf product for easier purchase by only BIM or or only Mechanical focused clients but for people who want/need both BIM and Mechanical the modules based route is more flexible and they could still sell the combination with module as a single product with a single license key as they are doing now with V19. So I agree with you that there is not really much advantage in having only verticals and it might actually cause them to lose some sales opportunities for those wanting/needing both but now having the impression they need to buy two separate full software licenses like AutoCAD. Unless they are going to introduce a BricsCAD Master Suite (as it is called in my account) at a later date that has both BIM and Mech.

    I'm not a typical BIM or a typical Mech user, as I work across multiple disciplines and would need features of both so "crippling" the base functionality by splitting it up as "typical BIM" or "typical Mech" and take it out of Platinum is something that I wouldn't be enthusiast about. Right now it is all a bit confusing to figure out what is or isn't available/possible.

  • I don't have all-in, but I am worrying about some features removed in Platinum and moved to Mechanical module, I cannot afford the upgrade price of Mechanical module. As there is no feature comparison table found on website, I will install Platinum v19 trial on another computer to compare.

  • So as I understand this, and correct me if I am wrong.

    To upgrade from V18 Platinum to V19 Platinum it will cost $519.75 AUD (fair enough)

    It appears that I have to take out a 'mandatory' All in maintenance account for $445.50 AUD (I have never had this and don't need it now)

    Therefore a total of nearly $1000.00 AUD just to upgrade to Platinum.

    However, if I want to upgrade to Mechanical it will cost another $700.00 AUD and the maintenance contract will jump from
    $445.50 to $655.00 AUD ???? Totals nearly $2000 AUD

    I am also confused as the press has stated that mechanical is now part of platinum so what is going on there?

    This is quite a substantial amount for the single user that has generally only seen a $50 rise each year in upgrade fees.

    Can someone please explain?

  • @fredericklim said:
    I don't have all-in, but I am worrying about some features removed in Platinum and moved to Mechanical module, I cannot afford the upgrade price of Mechanical module. As there is no feature comparison table found on website, I will install Platinum v19 trial on another computer to compare.

    I will abandon the trial as trial usually enabled all features, cannot accurately tell what are missing in Platinum only.

  • @fredericklim said:

    I will abandon the trial as trial usually enabled all features, cannot accurately tell what are missing in Platinum only.

    In SETTINGS you modify RunAsLevel to select the level of BricsCAD you want to run. Below this you should see additional settings UseBIM, UseMechanical, and UseCommunicator to control these features. Any change will require a restart of the application to commit.

    Regards,
    Jason Bourhill
    CAD Concepts

  • All good things must come to an end. I've seen it many times before. I started using Bricscad at version 4 and have continuously purchased upgrades. Bricscad is now too expensive for me to continue with so I have purchased my last upgrade. Adding and then removing features and moving them to a higher cost version has been happening continuously but now insisting upon yearly maintenance is the last straw. I cannot afford to add Mechanical to be able to do the things I need to do. I will continue to use Bricscad at work since my company can afford the now large sum of money for all the features I need to use, but I will no longer be able to try things out and update my skills at home in my free time with my personal license which is how I learned all the new features. I don't have time for learning at work, I have work to do. Yes, you can still use a second copy on a laptop but the one my company has does not compare to what I have at home to work on. What's the next step, no perpetual license? Too bad that Bricsys has gone the way of many other companies that get bought out.

  • Same feelings here. Things turn out the way exactly as I feared when I first read the news about the merger.
    In order to renew my all-in-subscription to again include BIM functionality, I would have to pay 799,50 € - which I will clearly not do.
    (My company uses ArchiCAD, I try to keep up with BricsCAD development on my own expenses...)

  • edited November 13

    OK ....

    Same here.
    I still wait for the SR reply to my reply regarding this.

  • edited November 13

    Ralph Grabowski's definitive What's New In v19
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/jrgio05ewieep8h/Whats-New-BricsCAD-V19.pdf?dl=0
    a great expansion on Brics's Release Notes.

    Steve Johnson's v19 Pricing Changes Explained
    https://www.cadnauseam.com/2018/11/13/bricscad-v19-pricing-changes-explained
    doesn't quite seem to cover the complaints being aired here.

  • I think a lot of us were sceptical regarding the take over and pricing and it appears that scepticism is now looking true.
    Pity because bricscad is a brilliant product but is now getting out of reach for the smaller size users.

  • edited November 13

    No, that was a misunderstanding.
    v18 Platinum + All In + BIM + All in
    is meant to result in a
    Bricscad v19 BIM

    I was told to try to license my v19 Platinum Number again,
    which I did after an deactivation and suddenly BIM was activated too.
    Also after a Account Site Refresh, my v19 package is now called
    Bricscad v19 BIM.

    A whole Mountain fell from my heart and everything fine now.

  • @RSW said:
    How about those of us who now have both the BIM and Sheet metal (and Communicator if applicable, which I do have as well but not everyone may have it) modules because we work multidisciplinary and do general 2d/3d drafting, civil, BIM and mechanical etc.? Will it still be possible to have BIM and Mechanical the old way like it was with the modules of will we be forced to buy BricsCAD Mechanical AND BricsCAD BIM licenses to be able to work in multiple disciplines and as such making the total more expensive than a complete AutoCAD suite? Or will there be an option to have the BIM or Mechanical functionality added to BricsCAD Mechanical or BricsCAD BIM respectively?

    Hi RSW,

    We are working on a product that we'll (likely) call BricsCAD Ultimate. It will consist of Platinum + BIM + Mechanical. It will be competitive price-wise, and less expensive than purchasing a BricsCAD BIM and a BricsCAD Mechanical. BricsCAD Ultimate will of course be available as a perpetual (permanent) license.

    Communicator will continue to be a stand-alone module, because we want to give our customers a choice. If they need it, fine. If not, no need to pay for it. Sorry if that has been mis-quoted in the press; I'll strive to be more clear in the future.

    We've made All-In Maintenance opt-out for V19. That way, buyers can easily see the least expensive way to get the next version of BricsCAD. If they don't want maintenance, they can opt out in their shopping cart. Don't forget that Priority Support is also included in All-In Maintenance, too.

    Thanks for using BricsCAD!

    -Don

  • Deactivating and reactivating the license (as Michael suggested) did not work in my case. I renewed my subscription for platinum and bim in September, but according to the website, I now have a BIM V18 and a Platinum V19 license - I activated V19 and BIM-functionality is indeed missing.
    But Michael's post makes me hope this is unintended...

  • @Don Strimbu said:

    We've made All-In Maintenance opt-out for V19. That way, buyers can easily see the least expensive way to get the next version of BricsCAD. If they don't want maintenance, they can opt out in their shopping cart. Don't forget that Priority Support is also included in All-In Maintenance, too.

    Isn't that for new license purchases only? All-In Maintenance would be mandatory for those upgrading.

    Regards,
    Jason Bourhill
    CAD Concepts

  • @Knut Hohenberg said:
    Deactivating and reactivating the license (as Michael suggested) did not work in my case. I renewed my subscription for platinum and bim in September, but according to the website, I now have a BIM V18 and a Platinum V19 license - I activated V19 and BIM-functionality is indeed missing.
    But Michael's post makes me hope this is unintended...

    Raise a support request to ask for the BricsCAD BIM. Your Platinum V19 will be upgraded.

    Regards,
    Jason Bourhill
    CAD Concepts

  • @Jason Bourhill said:

    Isn't that for new license purchases only? All-In Maintenance would be mandatory for those upgrading.

    Yes Jason, you can opt out on a new V19 license. If you want to upgrade that license in the future, you'll have to put that license back on All-In Maintenance first.

  • @Don Strimbu said:

    @Jason Bourhill said:

    Isn't that for new license purchases only? All-In Maintenance would be mandatory for those upgrading.

    Yes Jason, you can opt out on a new V19 license. If you want to upgrade that license in the future, you'll have to put that license back on All-In Maintenance first.

    So your hitting all the past customers a 275% increase. Nice work......................................

  • edited November 14

    @Don Strimbu said:

    We are working on a product that we'll (likely) call BricsCAD Ultimate. It will consist of Platinum + BIM + Mechanical. It will be competitive price-wise, and less expensive than purchasing a BricsCAD BIM and a BricsCAD Mechanical. BricsCAD Ultimate will of course be available as a perpetual (permanent) license.

    so the price will be something about 4000€ not 4400€?
    in V18 this was possible for about a full bricscad platinum price!
    now in V19 its an increase of 400%....

    i just want to show you an image from your presentation on the bricsys 2018
    is this not just a misleading of your customers? not just to show but to present a whole panel at bricsys 2018, with the advantage of having a lower price then then other software developers (autodesk), and at the same time increasing the price for the software by 400%... its not cool...
    where is the idea of offering a known platform for a price you can afford?

    image.png
    1078 x 523 - 164K
  • @fs_at12 said:

    so the price will be something about 4000€ not 4400€?
    in V18 this was possible for about a full bricscad platinum price!
    now in V19 its an increase of 400%....

    If you're an existing user, then the store pricing can give grossly distorted values for users with multiple products & maintenance. Best to contact your local agent and talk with them.

    i just want to show you an image from your presentation on the bricsys 2018
    is this not just a misleading of your customers? not just to show but to present a whole panel at bricsys 2018, with the advantage of having a lower price then then other software developers (autodesk), and at the same time increasing the price for the software by 400%... its not cool...
    where is the idea of offering a known platform for a price you can afford?

    Robert's slide would of been correct at the time. Most likely he was working with V18 pricing. It's changed with V19 but not drastically so. Attach a spreadsheet that allows you to play with the numbers yourself.

    Regards,
    Jason Bourhill
    CAD Concepts

    xlsx
    xlsx
    BricsCAD Standalone - Cost Comparison USD.xlsx
    34K
    pdf
    pdf
    BricsCAD Standalone - Cost Comparison USD.pdf
    188K
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